Post: #61

(03-04-2013 03:15 AM)JollyRoger Wrote:  No reason to believe they wouldn't be either.

That's idiotic. You can imagine all you like, but the fact remains that in every place they have done this program, and through every study that has ever been done on the subject, drug use among welfare recipients is 2-4%

But Santa Clause COULD be real too, right?

Post: #62

(03-04-2013 03:16 AM)JollyRoger Wrote:  I. as a tax payer, would MUCH rather spend 100 dollars on a test than BILLIONS in payouts to recipients who just use the money for drugs. And the occasional hoe.

You aren't spending a hundred dollars to save billions.

The Florida program operated at a net loss, that's a fact and there is no way around it. Drug testing costs more than it saves. If you want to expand the welfare system, go right ahead and support drug testing. Glad you like higher taxes.

Post: #63

(03-04-2013 03:33 AM)Captain Six Wrote:  

(03-04-2013 03:15 AM)JollyRoger Wrote:  No reason to believe they wouldn't be either.

That's idiotic. You can imagine all you like, but the fact remains that in every place they have done this program, and through every study that has ever been done on the subject, drug use among welfare recipients is 2-4%

But Santa Clause COULD be real too, right?

no more idiotic than your silly notions.

Smoke a bong. You'll feel better.

Post: #64

(03-04-2013 03:37 AM)JollyRoger Wrote:  

(03-04-2013 03:33 AM)Captain Six Wrote:  

(03-04-2013 03:15 AM)JollyRoger Wrote:  No reason to believe they wouldn't be either.

That's idiotic. You can imagine all you like, but the fact remains that in every place they have done this program, and through every study that has ever been done on the subject, drug use among welfare recipients is 2-4%

But Santa Clause COULD be real too, right?

no more idiotic than your silly notions.

Smoke a bong. You'll feel better.

I haven't smoked weed in 20 years and have no desire to.

Post: #65

Seems like the real problem is drugs,which,in other words,is money,which,in other words,is the root of all evil...

And while the law makers and the police go out of their way to bust regular people for doing a few lines of coke and smoking a joint on a friday or saturday night after working all week,the law makers and the police look the other way and receive financial kickbacks while allowing vast amounts of cocaine and every other drug to be shipped into america behind the scenes and then infiltrated into the american population...

Then those same law makers unleash their police who are told to go out and bust the regular janes and joes for doing those drugs,which is the law and the police creating their own job security,while eliminating the undesirable elements of society...

While the real criminals wearing suits and driving mercedes live above the law while buying their way out of jail by being able to afford high powered attorneys...

And every so often a high profile person will be busted for drugs and extortion,just so the american sheeple think somethings being done about it...

Post: #66

(03-04-2013 05:28 AM)Beyond Smolensk Wrote:  Seems like the real problem is drugs,which,in other words,is money,which,in other words,is the root of all evil...

And while the law makers and the police go out of their way to bust regular people for doing a few lines of coke and smoking a joint on a friday or saturday night after working all week,the law makers and the police look the other way and receive financial kickbacks while allowing vast amounts of cocaine and every other drug to be shipped into america behind the scenes and then infiltrated into the american population...

Then those same law makers unleash their police who are told to go out and bust the regular janes and joes for doing those drugs,which is the law and the police creating their own job security,while eliminating the undesirable elements of society...

While the real criminals wearing suits and driving mercedes live above the law while buying their way out of jail by being able to afford high powered attorneys...

And every so often a high profile person will be busted for drugs and extortion,just so the american sheeple think somethings being done about it...

Exactly. And all of this has made America the biggest police state in the world. Now they are coming for our 4th Amendment rights under the guise of saving us money, and fueled by racism and the biases associated with class warfare.

America keeps more people in prison than any other nation on the planet, including Communist Chine with their billion+ population. Not per capita either, raw numbers. Per capita they don't even hold a candle to us. The US houses 25% of the world's TOTAL prison population, thanks to the ridiculous war on drugs.

Post: #67

Ahem ,,,

real simple

don't like welfare , don't use it

don't like testing , don't do it

don't like taxes , don't pay them

don't like drugs , don't use them

don't like the way the world is running ,,, tuff darts , you're stuck in it

everything stated in this thread is Sophistry .


You can live and be in a Reality where none of it exist


you unplug from it

I assure you , I mastered it decades ago by not being it ,,, from my youth

Easy for me to say ?

Obviously it's not impossible .

Post: #68

(03-04-2013 06:43 AM)Cynicalabsurdance Wrote:  Ahem ,,,

real simple

don't like welfare , don't use it

don't like testing , don't do it

don't like taxes , don't pay them

don't like drugs , don't use them

don't like the way the world is running ,,, tuff darts , you're stuck in it

everything stated in this thread is Sophistry .


You can live and be in a Reality where none of it exist


you unplug from it

I assure you , I mastered it decades ago by not being it ,,, from my youth

Easy for me to say ?

Obviously it's not impossible .

So in other words, when they come to take away your Constitutional rights, you won't complain protest or resist, and anyone who does should just shut up.

Post: #69

Post: #70

Post: #71

(03-04-2013 08:48 AM)Cynicalabsurdance Wrote:  gawd what a fucking cartoon this world is.


Tell ya what

you all worry about this stupid shit if you choose to

Meanwhile .....

So in other words you really don't care and your comments are completely pointless.

Meanwhile, I will continue to point out things that are wrong, ways we should be doing things better, I will resist when they come to take my guns and my rights, and I will work toward a better tomorrow.

Post: #72

Capt 6

why do you succumb to my taunting ?

consider the post bait

i bait you

you rebuttal it , and i have you bantering

i have power over you then

and you lost

I suggest you ignore me

Post: #73

(03-04-2013 09:09 AM)Cynicalabsurdance Wrote:  Capt 6

why do you succumb to my taunting ?

consider the post bait

i bait you

you rebuttal it , and i have you bantering

i have power over you then

and you lost

I suggest you ignore me

I came here to discuss a topic and share information.

You obviously came here to troll.

Stop stinking up the thread with your useless posts.

Post: #74

Thanks for bumping my thread.

Post: #75

(03-04-2013 07:58 AM)Captain Six Wrote:  

(03-04-2013 06:43 AM)Cynicalabsurdance Wrote:  Ahem ,,,

real simple

don't like welfare , don't use it

don't like testing , don't do it

don't like taxes , don't pay them

don't like drugs , don't use them

don't like the way the world is running ,,, tuff darts , you're stuck in it

everything stated in this thread is Sophistry .


You can live and be in a Reality where none of it exist


you unplug from it

I assure you , I mastered it decades ago by not being it ,,, from my youth

Easy for me to say ?

Obviously it's not impossible .

So in other words, when they come to take away your Constitutional rights, you won't complain protest or resist, and anyone who does should just shut up.

"When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.

When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.

When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.

When they came for the Jews,
I remained silent;
I wasn't a Jew.

When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out"

Martin Niemoller

Post: #76

I just want to know why people get so riled up about some lazy person collecting a few hundred bucks a month but not the following:

- bloated military contracts
- a patently unfair tax system that favors the 'super rich' so that their sources of income are taxed at a much lower rate than employment income, and they can hide a lot of things as well.
- the trillions in bailouts and the ensuing price inflation from the great financial crisis
- NEPOTISM. How many lazy-ass brats from the Government right down to some mom-and-pop restaurant got a job because of who they know, do sweet FA and everyone else has to either kiss their ass, or do all their work as well as one's own?

There are plenty of things that get my goat more than that. The only thing that annoys me is when 'trashy' people spawn a bunch of kids they don't raise properly.
Mandatory contraception with welfare might not be a bad idea, but drug testing is, as the OP pointed out, a colossal waste of money.

Post: #77

Good to see you Jessica!

Post: #78

The abuse of the system goes beyond buying drugs....

Quote:In addition to placing specific restrictions on where Electronic Benefit Transfer cards can be used, the Senate bill would bar businesses from accepting them for purchases of alcohol, tobacco or lottery tickets.

Initial violations would result in misdemeanor charges, but repeat offenders would face felony charges.

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/govt-...38d35.html

...let's not forget bingo halls and casinos - did I miss anything? oh yes, taking a taxi to and from the beer store.

Post: #79

What I have learned from this thread is that OP wants to get high using food stamps.

Post: #80

(03-05-2013 06:23 PM)I⊥∀NIW∩LLIʞ Wrote:  What I have learned from this thread is that OP wants to get high using food stamps.

Salvia is still legal to purchase. Anyway, people will always find new ways to get high.

http://www.webmd.com/parenting/features/salvia-faq

Post: #81

This is a good topic for discussion. Let's keep it civil and not get personal. After all, all we can do is talk about it. Like I think Rog was insinuating, there ain't a damn thing we can do about it.





Wanna fix this? It's simple. Put all welfare recipients to work. No, I didn't say make them get a job. Put their asses to work. Give them bags and make them pick up trash. Give them cleaning products and make them scrub graffiti from public walls. Put them in work crews repairing the infrastructure. Get rid of the over priced private contractors that have taken over the jobs that the states used to take care of and put the welfare workers to work doing those jobs for their check. They don't want to work? Then they don't want their check.

Post: #82

That's common sense for those able to work, however common sense is in short supply. There is no question the US should have a safety net for the unemployed, but it becomes problematic when they are running endless wars and giving away poor peoples money to rich people in other countries under the guise of foreign aid.
These are things that should be eliminated instead of medicaid cuts etc.

Post: #83

The world doesn't have to be fucked up. It is that way by design.

Post: #84

Keeps the .01% owning most everything and the 4.99% that do their bidding appear to be in charge. All the worlds a stage.

Post: #85

(03-05-2013 06:13 PM)Jessica6 Wrote:  I just want to know why people get so riled up about some lazy person collecting a few hundred bucks a month but not the following:

- bloated military contracts
- a patently unfair tax system that favors the 'super rich' so that their sources of income are taxed at a much lower rate than employment income, and they can hide a lot of things as well.
- the trillions in bailouts and the ensuing price inflation from the great financial crisis
- NEPOTISM. How many lazy-ass brats from the Government right down to some mom-and-pop restaurant got a job because of who they know, do sweet FA and everyone else has to either kiss their ass, or do all their work as well as one's own?

There are plenty of things that get my goat more than that. The only thing that annoys me is when 'trashy' people spawn a bunch of kids they don't raise properly.
Mandatory contraception with welfare might not be a bad idea, but drug testing is, as the OP pointed out, a colossal waste of money.

Good post. And a source of perplexity to me too. Why are people penny smart and dollar stupid? Because they're lead by the MSM.

The reason the gov wants 'trashy' people reproducing is because they reproduce copiously and they need the workers just smart enouigh to do the job but never think for themselves (thank you George Carlin). Who will pay the bills if nobody's working? Those dumbed down American Idol fans will go pay their taxes and do the grung work and accumulate the debt the banks need them to. Capatin Six has a good point but it's lost on today's culture.

Post: #86

(03-05-2013 06:13 PM)Jessica6 Wrote:  I just want to know why people get so riled up about some lazy person collecting a few hundred bucks a month but not the following:

- bloated military contracts
- a patently unfair tax system that favors the 'super rich' so that their sources of income are taxed at a much lower rate than employment income, and they can hide a lot of things as well.
- the trillions in bailouts and the ensuing price inflation from the great financial crisis
- NEPOTISM. How many lazy-ass brats from the Government right down to some mom-and-pop restaurant got a job because of who they know, do sweet FA and everyone else has to either kiss their ass, or do all their work as well as one's own?

There are plenty of things that get my goat more than that. The only thing that annoys me is when 'trashy' people spawn a bunch of kids they don't raise properly.
Mandatory contraception with welfare might not be a bad idea, but drug testing is, as the OP pointed out, a colossal waste of money.

Mandatory contraception is a serious violation of rights too. HOWEVER, I would go along with a policy that promises no additional welfare payout for more than one child. The only exception would be for children not conceived while the person was on welfare. This would allow for parents who are divorced or widowed to still collect a benefit for each child.

Basically take away the method of spawning for profit.

Post: #87

(03-05-2013 06:20 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  The abuse of the system goes beyond buying drugs....

Quote:In addition to placing specific restrictions on where Electronic Benefit Transfer cards can be used, the Senate bill would bar businesses from accepting them for purchases of alcohol, tobacco or lottery tickets.

Initial violations would result in misdemeanor charges, but repeat offenders would face felony charges.

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/govt-...38d35.html

...let's not forget bingo halls and casinos - did I miss anything? oh yes, taking a taxi to and from the beer store.

Completely ignorant article meant to stigmatize the poor and give the impression that fraud is rampant. All to pit society against itself. To make the middle class believe that the victims of flawed economic policy are the cause of it, while deflecting from the real culprits who make these idiotic laws.

As far as your example of taking a cab to and from the "beer store" you display your own ignorance about the realities of the poor and low-wage workers. Yes, people on welfare have jobs too. But often times, because of poor credit, they do not have a bank account to cash their checks. Where are the check-cashing places and pay-day loan brokers? At beer stores! So to cash their paycheck a single mother may indeed have to take a cab ride to the beer store.

"Reports surfaced last year that Missourians were using electronic benefit transfer cards at ATMs near bars, casinos and strip clubs."

Oh nose! So what if your nearby grocery store happens to be across the street from a strip club or a bar? Does that mean you have to pay for a cab to go all the way across town instead now?

Or what if you happen to be a low wage worker that actually works in one of those places? Not allowed to buy lunch when you are at work?

“These cards have been used in Las Vegas and on islands off the mainland,”

So? Someone is not allowed to go visit family in Vegas?

Islands off the mainland. That actually brings a perfect example to mind. A friend of mine is a firefighter. In his department there is a young single mother from Puerto Rico. She gets public assistance even though she works full time and spends countless hours working for FREE serving her community as a volunteer firefighter.

A few months ago I joined them on a pleasure trip with their fire company to Foxwoods casino. The trip was fully funded by the fire department, included a meal voucher, and even included a $50 voucher for gambling. We all decided to eat at the buffet which was $6 more than the meal voucher. So rather than go eat alone, she went to the ATM and withdrew cash using her EBT card. I have no way of knowing which account she drew the funds from though.

You see, foodstamps cannot be credited as cash. They can only be used directly for non-prepared food purchases. You can buy a can of chili off the shelf at a gas station, but you can't buy one of those hotdogs sizzling away on the rollers. It's electronically monitored and will not process the sale.

Then there is TANF funds, or "cash assistance." Cash assistance is used for all non-food needs. everything from trash bags and light bulbs, to a late night cab ride from work because you missed the last bus.

But there is ALSO child support payment funds on EBT cards. A person may not be on any sort of public assistance at all, but because the support payments are processed by the state the funds are deposited onto the EBT card. Should a woman not be allowed to buy diapers for hir children in Las Vegas?

And the Puerto Rican girl who is the firefighter. She is going home to visit family she has not seen in 3 years. Should she be barred from accessing all of her funds, state assistance and child support, while she is in Puerto Rico, an offshore island?

"...the Senate bill would bar businesses from accepting them for purchases of alcohol, tobacco or lottery tickets."

This is already prohibited. So they are throwing that in there to make it sound like people can actually buy those things right now. They cannot. In fact, here in NY, you can't even use your very own personal credit card or bank card to buy lottery tickets.

"But the measure stops short of blocking all use for such expenses because recipients could still withdraw cash from other ATMs to use elsewhere. “We can’t completely stop them from using the money inappropriately, but I think this is the right thing to do,” Kraus said."

So even the sponsor of the bill realizes it is completely pointless. This is what we pay our lawmakers for. To sit around and find ways to antagonize the poor and spend millions of tax dollars creating completely ineffective laws. Millions of dollars that might have prevented the next few hundred families from slipping out of the middle class, and onto welfare themselves.

Post: #88

(03-05-2013 06:23 PM)I⊥∀NIW∩LLIʞ Wrote:  What I have learned from this thread is that OP wants to get high using food stamps.

I do not get high, and I have a job. Next.

Post: #89

(03-05-2013 10:52 PM)Kreeper Wrote:  This is a good topic for discussion. Let's keep it civil and not get personal. After all, all we can do is talk about it. Like I think Rog was insinuating, there ain't a damn thing we can do about it.





Wanna fix this? It's simple. Put all welfare recipients to work. No, I didn't say make them get a job. Put their asses to work. Give them bags and make them pick up trash. Give them cleaning products and make them scrub graffiti from public walls. Put them in work crews repairing the infrastructure. Get rid of the over priced private contractors that have taken over the jobs that the states used to take care of and put the welfare workers to work doing those jobs for their check. They don't want to work? Then they don't want their check.

Forced labor is slavery.

Besides, work has been a requirement for welfare since 1996. Up to 80% of Walamrt employees in some places are on welfare, thanks to the low wages paid and high profits taken by the Walton family. The economy of Wlamart is as large as Spain's economy, yet the pay for no doctors or hospitals, no holidays, no human services of any kind.

There is no reason to force someone into meaningless drudgery simply because the powers that be have befouled the economy so badly that there are millions upon millions of people without jobs.



Another example too, is one that happened in my home city. Crossing guards were considered to be municipal employees , and as such were paid a few dollars more per hour than min wage, had a fair-priced medical plan, and a few other benefits which made it a somewhat decent job especially for people like divorcees with grown kids, people who had health problems, things of that nature. Allowing them to pay in to the state retirement system was another benefit.

Then one day the the welfare office decided that they were going to force recipients to be crossing guards as part of a work program. They would get no pay, but rather the job they would be doing would be considered "job training." This helped the mayor slash his budget, and put hundreds of crossing guards out of work, and onto welfare!

Post: #90

(03-06-2013 01:21 PM)Captain Six Wrote:  

(03-05-2013 06:23 PM)I⊥∀NIW∩LLIʞ Wrote:  What I have learned from this thread is that OP wants to get high using food stamps.

I do not get high, and I have a job. Next.

When I was in rehab for heroin addiction a few years back (clean now, 2 years+) a woman told me she would use her food stamp card to buy poppy seeds at the grocery store (organic section, red mill brand i think) and make poppy seed tea and drink it to keep from going through withdrawals.

Story has always stuck in my head..