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Dixie
12-20-2013, 05:35 PM #1
Wayne5 Member
Posts:660 Threads:61 Joined:Nov 2013
"Dixie" is the theme song for many southerners. But a lot of them don't really know what its says and where it came from.

It was a story about a black former slave, told by minstrels in black face, that was longing to be back in his old circumstance. It was (and still is for some) the belief that eventually all the escaped slaves would regret their being free and return to the slavery that they unconsciously loved.

Some people today in the news believe that Black people were happier before the civil rights movement, and that the whole race was lead astray by uppity Black radicals like MLK.

So here are the lyrics, judge for yourself.


I wish I was in the land of cotton,
Old times they are not forgotten;
Look away! Look away! Look away! Dixie Land.
In Dixie Land where I was born in,
Early on one frosty mornin,
Look away! Look away! Look away! Dixie Land.

Old Missus marry "Will-de-weaber,"
Willium was a gay deceaber;
Look away! Look away! Look away! Dixie Land.
But when he put his arm around'er,
He smiled as fierce as a forty-pound'er,
Look away! Look away! Look away! Dixie Land.

Dar's buck-wheat cakes an 'Ingen' batter,
Makes you fat or a little fatter;
Look away! Look away! Look away! Dixie Land.
Den hoe it down an scratch your grabble,
To Dixie land I'm bound to trabble.
Look away! Look away! Look away! Dixie Land.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dixie_%28song%29
12-20-2013, 05:46 PM #2
Shadow Mrs. Buckwheat
Posts:12,782 Threads:1,182 Joined:Feb 2011
Interesting. Touchy subject. I can see being emancipated would toss them into the unkown, very few skills except labor, no possessions and little work. No idea how to fend for themselves and their families. It would be hard.
12-20-2013, 07:18 PM #3
yankees skier
Posts:5,898 Threads:215 Joined:Feb 2011
I don't recall ever hearing more than the first verse. I guess it's because I turn it off.

Biere.
12-21-2013, 12:37 AM #4
Softy Incognito Anonymous
 
Hi Wayne5,

Interesting,,,and yeah got the Sharpton and the

Jessie Jackson to keep feeding the fires,,,or they

probably would have gone out by now,,,and need to

remind everyone how miserable they are,,,less they

forget...

(:X
12-21-2013, 01:34 AM #5
Wayne5 Member
Posts:660 Threads:61 Joined:Nov 2013
Incidents in the Life of a Slave Girl
by Harriet Jacobs

Harriet was born in 1813. This is what she had to say about what masters told slaves:

SLAVEHOLDERS pride themselves upon being honorable men; but if you were to hear the enormous lies they tell their slaves, you would have small respect for their veracity. I have spoken plain English. Pardon me. I cannot use a milder term. When they visit the north, and return home, they tell their slaves of the runaways they have seen, and describe them to be in the most deplorable condition. A slaveholder once told me that he had seen a runaway friend of mine in New York, and that she besought him to take her back to her master, for she was literally dying of starvation; that many days she had only one cold potato to eat, and at other times could get nothing at all. He said he refused to take her, because he knew her master would not thank him for bringing such a miserable wretch to his house. He ended by saying to me, "This is the punishment she brought on herself for running away from a kind master."

This whole story was false. I afterwards staid with that friend in New York, and found her in comfortable circumstances. She had never thought of such a thing as wishing to go back to slavery. Many of the slaves believe such stories, and think it is not worth while to exchange slavery for such a hard kind of freedom. It is difficult to persuade such that freedom could make them useful men, and enable them to protect their wives and children. If those heathen in our Christian land had as much teaching as some Hindoos, they would think otherwise. They would know that liberty is more valuable than life. They would begin to understand their own capabilities, and exert themselves to become men and women.

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~hyper/jacobs/hjch8.htm
coffeetime.gif

The point is Dixie is a fraud. Slaves flourished under freedom and never wanted to be back in the hands of their masters. But a lot of people believed it, white and black.
12-21-2013, 04:04 AM #6
Softy Incognito Anonymous
 
Hi Wayne5,

Gee,,,I don't know much about this one,,,

I wasn't there,,,anyway,,,google is your friend...

How the end of slavery led to starvation and death for millions of black Americans

In the brutal chaos that followed the civil war, life after emancipation was harsh and often short, new book argues

Hundreds of thousands of slaves freed during the American civil war died from disease and hunger after being liberated, according to a new book.

After combing through obscure records, newspapers and journals Downs believes that about a quarter of the four million freed slaves either died or suffered from illness between 1862 and 1870. He writes in the book that it can be considered "the largest biological crisis of the 19th century" and yet it is one that has been little investigated by contemporary historians.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/ju...-civil-war

(:X
12-21-2013, 04:39 AM #7
blind prophet Member
Posts:527 Threads:11 Joined:Nov 2012
Drapetomania (greek from drapetes for runaway slave) was a supposed mental illness described by American physician Samuel A. Cartwright in 1851 that caused black slaves to flee captivity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drapetomania

A rather repulsive notion.

I turned myself to consider wisdom and madness and folly
The wise man’s eyes are in his head,
But the fool walks in darkness.
Yet I myself perceived
That the same event happens to them all.
12-21-2013, 06:30 AM #8
Wayne5 Member
Posts:660 Threads:61 Joined:Nov 2013
(12-21-2013, 04:04 AM)Softy Wrote:  Hi Wayne5,

Gee,,,I don't know much about this one,,,

I wasn't there,,,anyway,,,google is your friend...

How the end of slavery led to starvation and death for millions of black Americans

In the brutal chaos that followed the civil war, life after emancipation was harsh and often short, new book argues

Hundreds of thousands of slaves freed during the American civil war died from disease and hunger after being liberated, according to a new book.

After combing through obscure records, newspapers and journals Downs believes that about a quarter of the four million freed slaves either died or suffered from illness between 1862 and 1870. He writes in the book that it can be considered "the largest biological crisis of the 19th century" and yet it is one that has been little investigated by contemporary historians.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/ju...-civil-war

(:X

The song was written before 1861, the beginning of the Civil War. blind prophet is correct some thought that escaped slaves were mentally impaired. I should have said the escaped slaves that made to to the north flourished under freedom. The Confederacy fell in 1865, so until then Black Slaves were not free. 1865 to 1870 was a starving time for most of the
south, the southern states were ravaged by war. Reconstruction lasted till 1877. It was not a piece of cake being a black in a southern state but they didn't "long for slavery".
I would say that being able to keep your wife and children instead of them being sold constitutes flourishing compared to slavery.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconstruction_Era

Ironically in Texas and other states evil people knew no bounds. Managers of work gangs would send desired numbers of black workers to corrupt sheriffs and judges and just before the Managers would arrive there would be a mysterious crime wave. The newly convicted Blacks were worked, many times, to death and then replaced by more human sacrifices. Even with this they didn't "long for slavery".

Important points:

The Southern Baptist were created because of a schism over slavery, the Methodist split as well.

The southern seminaries came up with a doctrine that was preached all over the south based on an Old Testament verse telling people to buy gentile slaves and use them even as an inheritance. ( not to be confused with a system of family slavery for bankrupt family members). "Black Slavery is God's plan for mankind."

This was the first time the phrase "Inerrancy of the Scriptures" was used. Church members were told that if anyone talked against slavery that they didn't believe the Bible, so don't listen to them.

In the south only 5% of the population ever owned a slave.

I could go on for days. I am sure that no one here thinks that slavery was good or right or God's will.
coffeetime.gif
12-21-2013, 08:15 AM #9
White Ribbon call me
Posts:9,779 Threads:371 Joined:Apr 2013
Don't know the song in Australia. Black face isn't racial or an issue here. I guess we didn't have slavery and have no people from Africa. Australia had a white Australia policy until the 1950's or maybe the 60's. It was pretty bad and is clearly not PC. And the indigenous black aboriginal people have been treated badly and still are to a degree. They weren't allowed into my dads pub, they had their own pub that was totally trashed. Unfortunately they don't handle their alcohol well. And racism is still high.
12-21-2013, 08:26 AM #10
Softy Incognito Anonymous
 
Hi Wayne5,

well,,,I am not going to google this up,,,but read,,,

freed slaves faired no better,,,and sometimes worst,,,

in the North...

(:X
12-21-2013, 09:32 AM #11
Softy Incognito Anonymous
 
From that book link above,,,

Many northerners were little more sympathetic than their southern opponents when it came to the health of the freed slaves and anti-slavery abolitionists feared the disaster would prove their critics right.

Many ended up in encampments called "contraband camps" that were often near union army bases. However, conditions were unsanitary and food supplies limited. Shockingly, some contraband camps were actually former slave pens, meaning newly freed people ended up being kept virtual prisoners back in the same cells that had previously held them. In many such camps disease and hunger led to countless deaths.

Treatment by union soldiers could also be brutal. Downs reconstructed the experiences of one freed slave, Joseph Miller, who had come with his wife and four children to a makeshift freed slave refugee camp within the union stronghold of Camp Nelson in Kentucky. In return for food and shelter for his family Miller joined the army. Yet union soldiers in 1864 still cleared the ex-slaves out of Camp Nelson, effectively abandoning them to scavenge in a war-ravaged and disease-ridden landscape. One of Miller's young sons quickly sickened and died. Three weeks later, his wife and another son died. Ten days after that, his daughter perished too. Finally, his last surviving child also fell terminally ill. By early 1865 Miller himself was dead.

So bad were the health problems suffered by freed slaves, and so high the death rates, that some observers of the time even wondered if they would all die out. One white religious leader in 1863 expected black Americans to vanish.

(:X
12-22-2013, 04:13 AM #12
Wayne5 Member
Posts:660 Threads:61 Joined:Nov 2013
Well Softy, I looked up Jim Downs of Connecticut College and he's a real legitimate historian but he is leading you in a direction he wants you to go.

"Many northerners were little more sympathetic than their southern opponents when it came to the health of the freed slaves and anti-slavery abolitionists feared the disaster would prove their critics right."

First, "little more" means they were "more sympathetic".

"Many" is a word used when you don't want to tell how many. 1000 is many but not is its 1% of the whole.

So MANY northerners were sympathetic. Yes SOME abolitionists feared the disaster would prove their critics right and SOME thought it was totally unfounded. Then we have that "some" problem.

See what I mean.

It turns out, looking at African Americans of today, that these fears were totally unfounded, no matter if the fear was based on the opinion that Black people were not intelligence enough to survive or the fear of a lack of skill, drive, whatever to survive.

From your article:

By early 1865 Miller himself was dead.

So bad were the health problems suffered by freed slaves, and so high the death rates, that some observers of the time even wondered if they would all die out. One white religious leader in 1863 expected black Americans to vanish.

The Civil War didn't end until 1865. Miller and his family were casualties of war. "One white religious leader"... ok who was he and why does his opinion mean very much, he's not a Doctor.

You are being lead down the path.

Consider this from Vanderbilt University:

The American civil war resulted in a stagnation of human development in the United States. The war was characterized by advanced military technology and inferior medical techniques, resulting in unprecedented casualties for both sides. As a result, the life expectancy in the United States between 1860 and 1865 continued its decline from the previous three decades. Between 1860 and 1864 the average American citizen would live for 40.5 years, and between 1865 and 1869, it dropped to 40.0 years (Hacker, 47). After that 5-year span, life expectancy began to rise at a steady rate again, averaging out at 44.5 by 1880 (Hacker, 47). Education, too, worsened during the war, as less people attended school in order to fight for their side of the country. While the total percentage of 5 to 19-year olds in school only decreased 2.2%, this was due to a 9.0% increase in the percentage of African-Americans attendance in school (Snyder, 11). White participation (white participation is measured because the overwhelming majority of both armies was white), however, decreased by 5.2% to 54.4% during the war and the years after, showing how education was secondary to the war in almost half of students’ minds (Snyder, 11). However, between 1870 and 1880, after the war ended, education became more important as 62.0% of white children attended school (Snyder, 11).

https://my.vanderbilt.edu/f13afdevfilm/2...rra-leone/

Your author was talking about a time span from 1862-1870. Here we have 1865-1869 the average life spans of all American citizens dropping to 40 years because of inferior medical techniques.

Consider this as well:

Seasoning (slaves)

Seasoning was a process conducted during the Atlantic slave trade for the purpose of "breaking" slaves. It also took away the slaves' identities to make them more likely to do what they are told. Also during the seasoning process the slave would sometimes have hot tar and oil poured onto their sores and wounds so that they would fetch a higher price at auction.

The practice conditioned the African captives for their new lot in life; newly arrived African captives would have to be trained into the daily rigors that awaited them in the Americas. This training was carried out on plantations in the Caribbean, such as Jamaica.

Estimated mortality rates for this process vary from 7% to 50% with duration between one and four years.[1]

Most slaves destined for island or South American plantations were likely to be put through this ordeal, though slaves shipped directly to North America bypassed this process. Jamaica held one of the most notorious of these camps. [2]

The process of seasoning had a strong profit motive. For example, the average price of adult male slaves in Jamaica (1770s) was approximately 52% higher than "New Negroes" (Africans who came to a New World).[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seasoning_%28slave%29

"Seasoning" basically meant you held your slave for a "season", year, in case he died from the trip and the relocation. People didn't want to buy new slaves and have them die quickly.

Getting back to the song "Dixie". I have only recently understood what the song was about myself. I didn't have much of an opinion about it till I understood it. If Dixie said "the south is my home, its the best place on earth" I would not be offended by it. But it does not. It spins a story that was not true then and is not true now. It promotes the idea that slavery really is God's plan for mankind and that Black people will only be happy when they bow to God's will.

cheers.gif
12-22-2013, 07:33 AM #13
Softy Incognito Anonymous
 
Hi Wayne5,

Yeah,,,most authors/historians have some point they are

trying to prove,,,and include that data,,,and exclude the

rest,,,kinda like posting on the internet,,,and like I said

don't really know all the details,,,know the Irish and Blacks

competed for jobs in the North before and after the war,,,

and neither one was very well off,,,and some Blacks stayed on

the plantations,,,or returned,,,and some got 40 acres and a mule,,,

and went their own way,,,know the Buffalo solders came here

and other places and did a number on the Native Americans,,,

under the direction of others of course,,,anyway,,,rough life,,,

and don't know if better off in Africa fighting tribe wars,,,

coming here on plantations,,,fighting in the civil war,,,

or Buffalo solders,,,or whatever,,,was better or worst,,,

and single cases don't prove the whole,,,and didn't know about

the song,,,and sure not going to guess God's will in putting

together this melting pot,,,maybe preparation for WW2,,,or

some other big picture thing that I sure can't forecast,,,

so,,,interesting,,,and some would say we are all slaves,,,

though,,,by comparison can't quite agree with that one,,,

keep up the good posting...

(:X
12-22-2013, 07:48 AM #14
Wayne5 Member
Posts:660 Threads:61 Joined:Nov 2013
Thank you Softy. I have points I"m trying to prove as well and sometimes people like you actually change my mind. You ask really good questions and I learned a lot struggling to answer them.

Interesting that you mentioned Native Americans. After the Civil War the unfortunate slaves that were owned by Native Americans were not freed. That took a few more years.

cheers.gif



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