(07-12-2016, 06:15 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  Again, not finding 238 as fissible, but rather fissionable, that is, if Jupiter can provide enough high energy neurons, which we don't know, right?

Quote:the even isotopes, plutonium-238, -240, and -242 are not fissile but yet are fissionable–that is, they can only be split by high energy neutrons. Generally, fissionable but non-fissile isotopes cannot sustain chain reactions; plutonium-240 is an exception to that rule.

The minimum amount of material necessary to sustain a chain reaction is called the critical mass. A supercritical mass is bigger than a critical mass, and is capable of achieving a growing chain reaction where the amount of energy released increases with time.

The amount of material necessary to achieve a critical mass depends on the geometry and the density of the material, among other factors. The critical mass of a bare sphere of plutonium-239 metal is about 10 kilograms. It can be considerably lowered in various ways.

The amount of plutonium used in fission weapons is in the 3 to 5 kilograms range. According to a recent Natural Resources Defense Council report(1), nuclear weapons with a destructive power of 1 kiloton can be built with as little as 1 kilogram of weapon grade plutonium(2). The smallest theoretical critical mass of plutonium-239 is only a few hundred grams.

In contrast to nuclear weapons, nuclear reactors are designed to release energy in a sustained fashion over a long period of time. This means that the chain reaction must be controlled–that is, the number of neutrons produced needs to equal the number of neutrons absorbed. This balance is achieved by ensuring that each fission produces exactly one other fission.

http://ieer.org/resource/factsheets/plut...factsheet/

Yet, a similar mix of Pu-238/239 oxide as was provided with Galileo has shown to be both fissile and fissionable. Richard Garwin concluded this also is his report. An 80/20 mix is a viable weapon. Which is what Galileo had.

Once again, it's not DESIRABLE yet is does provide a low yield.

(07-12-2016, 06:20 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:15 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  Again, not finding 238 as fissible, but rather fissionable, that is, if Jupiter can provide enough high energy neurons, which we don't know, right?

Quote:the even isotopes, plutonium-238, -240, and -242 are not fissile but yet are fissionable–that is, they can only be split by high energy neutrons. Generally, fissionable but non-fissile isotopes cannot sustain chain reactions; plutonium-240 is an exception to that rule.

The minimum amount of material necessary to sustain a chain reaction is called the critical mass. A supercritical mass is bigger than a critical mass, and is capable of achieving a growing chain reaction where the amount of energy released increases with time.

The amount of material necessary to achieve a critical mass depends on the geometry and the density of the material, among other factors. The critical mass of a bare sphere of plutonium-239 metal is about 10 kilograms. It can be considerably lowered in various ways.

The amount of plutonium used in fission weapons is in the 3 to 5 kilograms range. According to a recent Natural Resources Defense Council report(1), nuclear weapons with a destructive power of 1 kiloton can be built with as little as 1 kilogram of weapon grade plutonium(2). The smallest theoretical critical mass of plutonium-239 is only a few hundred grams.

In contrast to nuclear weapons, nuclear reactors are designed to release energy in a sustained fashion over a long period of time. This means that the chain reaction must be controlled–that is, the number of neutrons produced needs to equal the number of neutrons absorbed. This balance is achieved by ensuring that each fission produces exactly one other fission.

http://ieer.org/resource/factsheets/plut...factsheet/

Yet, a similar mix of Pu-238/239 oxide as was provided with Galileo has shown to be both fissile and fissionable. Richard Garwin concluded this also is his report. An 80/20 mix is a viable weapon. Which is what Galileo had.

Once again, it's not DESIRABLE yet is does provide a low yield.

Pu-238 dioxide is mostly plutonium by weight and is considered ceramic in form and texture when manufactured. Pu-238 dioxide (which also contains a significant amount of Pu-239) was also proven to be even weaponable by Richard Garwin of the Jason Group (see Appendix W), and various other nuclear institutes, in purity of 80% or less Pu-238, which the G-R’s and LWRHU’s qualify as since not all of their plutonium is Pu-238, but a host of other Pu isotopes including a significant amount of Pu-239 (see Figure 39). To be fissile means to be capable of a sustained nuclear reaction under the right conditions. To be fissionable means it is capable of producing fission.

“In conclusion, separated plutonium-- whether weapon grade or reactor grade-- poses a similar danger of misuse in nuclear weapons and must be provided similar physical protection, control, and accountancy. This has been recognized by the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) from its beginning-- all plutonium (except Pu-238 of isotopic purity greater than 80%) [Our Pu-dioxide mix falls under 80% especially since it contains significant Pu-239 which is very weaponable] is regarded as equally hazardous from the point of view of diversion to nuclear weaponry.” (Brackets by JEC) [76]

(07-12-2016, 06:20 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:15 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  Again, not finding 238 as fissible, but rather fissionable, that is, if Jupiter can provide enough high energy neurons, which we don't know, right?

Quote:the even isotopes, plutonium-238, -240, and -242 are not fissile but yet are fissionable–that is, they can only be split by high energy neutrons. Generally, fissionable but non-fissile isotopes cannot sustain chain reactions; plutonium-240 is an exception to that rule.

The minimum amount of material necessary to sustain a chain reaction is called the critical mass. A supercritical mass is bigger than a critical mass, and is capable of achieving a growing chain reaction where the amount of energy released increases with time.

The amount of material necessary to achieve a critical mass depends on the geometry and the density of the material, among other factors. The critical mass of a bare sphere of plutonium-239 metal is about 10 kilograms. It can be considerably lowered in various ways.

The amount of plutonium used in fission weapons is in the 3 to 5 kilograms range. According to a recent Natural Resources Defense Council report(1), nuclear weapons with a destructive power of 1 kiloton can be built with as little as 1 kilogram of weapon grade plutonium(2). The smallest theoretical critical mass of plutonium-239 is only a few hundred grams.

In contrast to nuclear weapons, nuclear reactors are designed to release energy in a sustained fashion over a long period of time. This means that the chain reaction must be controlled–that is, the number of neutrons produced needs to equal the number of neutrons absorbed. This balance is achieved by ensuring that each fission produces exactly one other fission.

http://ieer.org/resource/factsheets/plut...factsheet/

Yet, a similar mix of Pu-238/239 oxide as was provided with Galileo has shown to be both fissile and fissionable. Richard Garwin concluded this also is his report. An 80/20 mix is a viable weapon. Which is what Galileo had.

Once again, it's not DESIRABLE yet is does provide a low yield.

Well it seems we are all guessing t this point.

More evidence from physicist Peter Zimmerman shows the viability of plutonium oxide, sometimes called Plutonium(IV), for use even as a low-yield weapon:
“PuO2, along with UO2, is used in MOX fuels for nuclear reactors. Plutonium-238 dioxide is used as fuel for several deep-space spacecraft… Physicist Peter Zimmerman, following up a suggestion by Ted Taylor, demonstrated that a low-yield (1-kiloton) nuclear weapon could be made relatively easily from plutonium oxide.” [74]

Data will be coming in fast, I hope.

(07-12-2016, 06:32 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTAmVoC6Jmk

Data will be coming in fast, I hope.

http://www.zamandayolculuk.com/plutoniumboms.htm

This link above also desribes how Pu-238 oxide is viable.

(07-12-2016, 06:32 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTAmVoC6Jmk

Data will be coming in fast, I hope.

Yes, NASA has remarked on the changing IR dynamics of Jupiter since 2009 and on....

http://phys.org/news/2012-10-jupiter-tur...g.html#jCp

(07-12-2016, 06:35 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:32 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTAmVoC6Jmk

Data will be coming in fast, I hope.

http://www.zamandayolculuk.com/plutoniumboms.htm

This link above also desribes how Pu-238 oxide is viable.

Interesting, but viable on Jupiter when we don't really know what Jupiter is made of?

(07-12-2016, 06:47 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:35 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:32 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTAmVoC6Jmk

Data will be coming in fast, I hope.

http://www.zamandayolculuk.com/plutoniumboms.htm

This link above also desribes how Pu-238 oxide is viable.

Interesting, but viable on Jupiter when we don't really know what Jupiter is made of?

Yes, all theory at this point. BUT remember that we have the evidence of the strange anomalous effects that before 2009 were considered very rare on Jupiter.

All of the supposed "impacts" do NOT make sense as impacts but they do as internally generated events. So, this makes the "fractional crit" theory more important at this point. It shows how decades of "Jupiter RARELY impacted" theory can be saved, and how the "Jupiter cannot get hit by asteroids these days..." theory can be saved.

(07-12-2016, 06:40 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:32 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTAmVoC6Jmk

Data will be coming in fast, I hope.

Yes, NASA has remarked on the changing IR dynamics of Jupiter since 2009 and on....

http://phys.org/news/2012-10-jupiter-tur...g.html#jCp

Quote:AI: Jupiter is the largest planet and it comes closest to having the same proportion of chemical elements (hydrogen, helium, oxygen, carbon, nitrogen, sulfur, etcetera) as the sun. Also, it is like a fluid dynamics laboratory where storms last for decades and the planet's rotation steers the winds into multiple jet streams.
With Juno, we would like to determine the average water abundance of the deep atmosphere. This question bears on the oxygen-to-hydrogen ratio on Jupiter compared to the ratio on the sun. The ratio is fundamental to how the elements were distributed through the early solar system and how Earth got its oceans. Additionally, we are trying to map how water and ammonia vary with latitude. This question bears on the weather below the visible clouds—a region we know little about. Jupiter has a very photogenic atmosphere, so we know a lot about the weather at the tops of the clouds. The unique phenomena there may derive their properties from the weather at deeper levels.


Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2016-07-juno-missio...r.html#jCp

(07-12-2016, 06:51 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:47 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:35 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:32 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTAmVoC6Jmk

Data will be coming in fast, I hope.

http://www.zamandayolculuk.com/plutoniumboms.htm

This link above also desribes how Pu-238 oxide is viable.

Interesting, but viable on Jupiter when we don't really know what Jupiter is made of?

Yes, all theory at this point. BUT remember that we have the evidence of the strange anomalous effects that before 2009 were considered very rare on Jupiter.

All of the supposed "impacts" do NOT make sense as impacts but they do as internally generated events. So, this makes the "fractional crit" theory more important at this point. It shows how decades of "Jupiter RARELY impacted" theory can be saved, and how the "Jupiter cannot get hit by asteroids these days..." theory can be saved.

As I said, I am not dismissing any theories at this point, just trying to make sense of this for myself, in my own way.

(07-12-2016, 06:53 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:40 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:32 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTAmVoC6Jmk

Data will be coming in fast, I hope.

Yes, NASA has remarked on the changing IR dynamics of Jupiter since 2009 and on....

http://phys.org/news/2012-10-jupiter-tur...g.html#jCp

Quote:AI: Jupiter is the largest planet and it comes closest to having the same proportion of chemical elements (hydrogen, helium, oxygen, carbon, nitrogen, sulfur, etcetera) as the sun. Also, it is like a fluid dynamics laboratory where storms last for decades and the planet's rotation steers the winds into multiple jet streams.
With Juno, we would like to determine the average water abundance of the deep atmosphere. This question bears on the oxygen-to-hydrogen ratio on Jupiter compared to the ratio on the sun. The ratio is fundamental to how the elements were distributed through the early solar system and how Earth got its oceans. Additionally, we are trying to map how water and ammonia vary with latitude. This question bears on the weather below the visible clouds—a region we know little about. Jupiter has a very photogenic atmosphere, so we know a lot about the weather at the tops of the clouds. The unique phenomena there may derive their properties from the weather at deeper levels.


Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2016-07-juno-missio...r.html#jCp

Yes, it is assumed Jupiter's composition is similar to the Sun's.

(07-12-2016, 06:55 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:51 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:47 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:35 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:32 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTAmVoC6Jmk

Data will be coming in fast, I hope.

http://www.zamandayolculuk.com/plutoniumboms.htm

This link above also desribes how Pu-238 oxide is viable.

Interesting, but viable on Jupiter when we don't really know what Jupiter is made of?

Yes, all theory at this point. BUT remember that we have the evidence of the strange anomalous effects that before 2009 were considered very rare on Jupiter.

All of the supposed "impacts" do NOT make sense as impacts but they do as internally generated events. So, this makes the "fractional crit" theory more important at this point. It shows how decades of "Jupiter RARELY impacted" theory can be saved, and how the "Jupiter cannot get hit by asteroids these days..." theory can be saved.

As I said, I am not dismissing any theories at this point, just trying to make sense of this for myself, in my own way.

Yes, and I thank you for the debate! I've already realized that there is a broken link in my book due to this debate. I will be fixing that tonight with the corrected link.

(07-12-2016, 07:00 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:55 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:51 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:47 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:35 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  http://www.zamandayolculuk.com/plutoniumboms.htm

This link above also desribes how Pu-238 oxide is viable.

Interesting, but viable on Jupiter when we don't really know what Jupiter is made of?

Yes, all theory at this point. BUT remember that we have the evidence of the strange anomalous effects that before 2009 were considered very rare on Jupiter.

All of the supposed "impacts" do NOT make sense as impacts but they do as internally generated events. So, this makes the "fractional crit" theory more important at this point. It shows how decades of "Jupiter RARELY impacted" theory can be saved, and how the "Jupiter cannot get hit by asteroids these days..." theory can be saved.

As I said, I am not dismissing any theories at this point, just trying to make sense of this for myself, in my own way.

Yes, and I thank you for the debate! I've already realized that there is a broken link in my book due to this debate. I will be fixing that tonight with the corrected link.

And thank you for the brain workout, now I am looking forward to my therapeutic massage (mindless abandon). lol

(07-12-2016, 07:05 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 07:00 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:55 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:51 PM)Anonymous Kritter Wrote:  

(07-12-2016, 06:47 PM)UniqueStranger Wrote:  Interesting, but viable on Jupiter when we don't really know what Jupiter is made of?

Yes, all theory at this point. BUT remember that we have the evidence of the strange anomalous effects that before 2009 were considered very rare on Jupiter.

All of the supposed "impacts" do NOT make sense as impacts but they do as internally generated events. So, this makes the "fractional crit" theory more important at this point. It shows how decades of "Jupiter RARELY impacted" theory can be saved, and how the "Jupiter cannot get hit by asteroids these days..." theory can be saved.

As I said, I am not dismissing any theories at this point, just trying to make sense of this for myself, in my own way.

Yes, and I thank you for the debate! I've already realized that there is a broken link in my book due to this debate. I will be fixing that tonight with the corrected link.

And thank you for the brain workout, now I am looking forward to my therapeutic massage (mindless abandon). lol

Sounds nice! lol